Podcast 210: We’re In the City; Did West secretly hate Ciara? More evidence that the timeline doesn’t add up; Darkside Danny

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“I think he is manipulatively apathetic. He’s good about making everybody feel seen and liked, but I don’t think he really cares about them unless it affects him.” – Amanda

Hear more about:
– “In the City” Exposes Amanda and Kyle’s Relationship Breakdown: Summer House seamlessly transitioned into “In the City,” revealing just how strained Amanda and Kyle’s marriage had become.
– Amanda and Kyle’s Financial Drama Raises Red Flags: Kyle allegedly requesting $117,000 in back rent exposed major imbalance in their marriage.
– Amanda and West’s Connection Looks More Serious Than Rumored: Amanda and West’s interactions in the Hamptons appeared emotionally charged, with timeline clues suggesting their relationship may have started long before the public announcement.
– West May Still Resent Ciara Miller: West’s behavior toward Ciara was framed as emotionally manipulative, with speculation that backlash from fans after their breakup fueled resentment.
– Bravo and Cocktails Becomes Part of the Bravo Narrative: The show directly referenced Bravo and Cocktails coverage, proving fan-driven gossip now plays a major role in shaping Bravo storylines.
– Danny’s Treatment of Nia Sparks Backlash on The Valley: Danny’s verbal outbursts toward Nia were described as emotionally abusive, with growing concern that his behavior goes beyond alcohol.
– Lala and Janet’s Situations Are Viewed Very Differently: Lala Kent was defended for confronting Danny after witnessing his behavior firsthand, while Janet was criticized for escalating secondhand drama.

Transcript of episode 210 of Cocktails and Gossip Podcast

B 0:00
What’s up, cocktailers? Amanda, the emails are flowing. I’m not sure if it’s because we are featured on In the City and people are remembering to email us or what, but I can’t keep up. I haven’t even posted most of them yet.

Amanda 0:12
We’ll take it. I love it when the gossip gods smile on us, and they have been smiling on us quite a bit.

B 0:20
I just want to say one thing at the top, because it’s confusing people. I’ve been linking to the homepage. The thing is, some people miss links. We all know how Instagram stories are, so I feel like if you click and you go to the homepage, so if you’re not seeing that exact post, just scroll a little bit. If it’s bringing you to homepage, it’s free tea, and it’s there within the last, yeah,

Amanda 0:41
just hit the read more, the pink read more button, and then you can see all of the articles, yeah. So I’m sorry if that’s confusing,

B 0:48
it’s a change, but then I think it’s helpful for people once they realize it, because then you don’t have to rely on my links, which you could miss. Sometimes we’ll talk about a free tea thing here, and I’ll get DMs, like you spoke about this on the pod, but I missed it, because when we get so much tea, I don’t even – I post most things once at this point, except if it’s a juicy cocktail thing, and so if I’m just linking to the one post, you guys are missing stuff, so I’m gonna be linking to the homepage, and if it’s not right there, scroll, and it’ll be within a couple of posts,

Amanda 1:17
yeah, yeah, and that read more button too, right towards the top, then it’ll show you all of the most recent free tea articles,

B 1:26
and we’ve been doing a lot of cool stuff too, like not worth those people. Shout out to Perry, because I like read those. I’m very into

Amanda 1:33
it. I have to say, I love how nosy all of us are as cocktailers, because those articles do, they do really well, and it’s because we’re all nosy bees.

B 1:41
Do you know how often I google net worth of whoever, whatever famous person, if I’m watching a movie, and so, yeah, like, oh yeah, I’m like, I’m like nerding out that we have it on our site now.

Amanda 1:53
I know it’s fun. It’s definitely a fun new kind of feature that we’ve been doing. We have barely talked this week.

B 1:59
It’s been,

Amanda 2:00
it is

Amanda 2:00
such a crazy, it’s May, but how are you doing? We’re two days out of the whole summer house in the city premiere. Do you have a hangover?

B 2:11
I have to say something, I wasn’t expecting to get so emotional at the scene, specifically with Kyle and Amanda, and we saw the cast very emotional, and I had posted this, but it’s not just that it’s the end of the summer, and obviously the scandal hadn’t happened yet, but

Amanda 2:28
right,

B 2:29
we all knew that in the city was happening, and I think the cast as a whole assumed that the OGs wouldn’t be back, at least I think that was time

Amanda 2:39
as a plan, yeah, yeah,

B 2:41
and to that point, there’s something I thought of today. Actually, you know how Carl’s really pissed and so angry at Carl. Carl’s so pissed at Kyle. He couldn’t say this on camera, but towards the end of the summer, when they had that blow up, Carl also likely found out that he was not cast for In the City.

Amanda 2:57
Yeah,

B 2:58
that was part of the blow up, but they can’t say it.

Amanda 3:00
Yeah, yes, and I think that’s if you guys get a chance, go back and watch again, because I think there’s a few things like that reading between the lines, like especially how I think about two, and we’ll talk more about this, but I think that things were going to change with Kyle and Amanda’s relationship, and that this kind of demarcation of the end of the season would be end of some of the ogs, but also I think at least Amanda and Kyle knew, and I think that’s why Amanda didn’t come that one weekend, is because I think it was getting harder and harder. You can see, yeah, this last episode she just avoids them the whole time because she wanted to be done, and I think there were just a lot of things that were bubbling beneath the surface. We’ll put

B 3:48
it that not to be cynical, but just on the coral piece, that’s also the reason he finally gives Lindsay an apology. I think he was really pushing to be cast, and I think that she was a big proponent for him not to be cast. We do hear, and cocktailers know that one of the reasons why they were at Upfronts together, and they have been friendlier, is because the network does see the value in Carl, and I think that Lindsay post scandal is warming, warmed up to the idea, and he will be on season two, should they get a green light, which I think they will,

Amanda 4:18
and I don’t want to take away by the practical piece of that from the absolute genuineness of that was such a good apology, it was a real apology. It wasn’t, I’m sorry, but and it wasn’t. He was listening, he wasn’t defensive, he

B 4:38
accountable for his

Amanda 4:39
actions,

Amanda 4:40
accountable, yeah. And I was trying to explain it to my husband, because my husband, I just don’t understand why, like, why was she so mad about Carl’s mom and all that? Like, because there’s a lot of things that you weren’t really into of this whole world then, and there were some things it would be so strange if somebody is saying these things. About me publicly, and dancing the night away, and then because we weren’t getting married, and then comes up and just wants a hug and wants to talk to me about my baby. Lindsay had every right to be upset about that, but this is why the show has just gotten so layered and so good, and I’m so glad we’re not losing some of these people that we love so much,

B 5:22
100% but back to the first, back to the scene with I wasn’t expecting it was incredibly heartbreaking to watch Kyle and Amanda, and when Amanda said, “I grew up in this house, she was 2324

Amanda 5:36
I definitely feel like, so we’re gonna have a hard time today, so we’re just going to call this out because of the way that they did this transition from the Hamptons to in the city, and that they’re this, it really one picks up from the other. We’re going to be talking about both a little bit, as much, try not to be as confusing as possible, but no problem is, I got, yeah, we’re going to try, but I felt like I got whiplash from this episode, I, while I understand, obviously new shows need a strong hook to get viewers interested. The way in the city started kind of threw me a little bit, because we go from they’re leaving the house, they’re coming to the city, it’s September, then it’s January with Kyle and Amanda announcing their split, and then then they talk about the West and Amanda scandal, and then it’s April, and they’re sitting on the couch talking, and then we’re back to September, and so guys, I consider myself a self-proclaimed bravo expert, but it did feel a little bit confusing, even to me, which is why I’m like, obviously from an editor standpoint, this is a really hard story to tell, because they have no choice but to address all the stuff that happened off camera as part of the show, but I really liked that transition. It reminded me very much, and I’m sure you guys all felt the same way, of how Real Housewives of Beverly Hills launched Vanderpump Rules.

B 7:05
Yes,

Amanda 7:05
how it really went in from one to the other, and I really liked that.

B 7:08
Something that I really reflected on watching the Amanda and Kyle conversation, first at the end of Summer House, and then on the first episode of In the City. We’ve often talked about on the pod how our sources. One of the reasons Andrea wasn’t invited back was because he was getting engaged to Lexi, and they want singles, and because Kyle is like the founding OG. Him and Amanda always were welcome back, and obviously their marriage had a lot of issues, but I couldn’t help but wonder if the network had said to them the year after they got married, or even right after they got married. That’s it. You guys can visit once in a while, but you’re out. Would their marriage have survived? Would their marriage have looked different? Would they have focused on it? Would they have moved to the suburbs like Amanda wanted years ago? Obviously, it doesn’t seem like something she currently wants. There’s no way to know, right? How much of it is different personalities, and it would have been an inevitable growing apart,

Amanda 8:03
and you and I have even imagined that behind the scenes some of the fights that Amanda and Kyle are probably having is Kyle feels the need to keep up the party to stay in the summer house, and that’s part of his persona, and would that have changed too,

B 8:22
and I do think that Lover Boy could have remained popular, and he could have kept promoting it, and I then there’s this other thing that came out on In the City, here we go with flip flopping between the shows, but we’re watching Amanda rightfully upset about Kyle’s career as a DJ, and we’re watching Kyle say, listen, we know he makes a ton of money, and will, as it continues, and he’s struggling financially, and on in the city, he apparently asked her for three years worth of back rent, which is $117,000 We’re gonna remember it’s New York City. Listen, these people could certainly move to a suburb or a borough or Jersey City and buy a condo with that kind of money as a down payment, and it would be smaller, and they would be able to afford it, but these people don’t want to do that. They’re not good with money, they have it coming in, they’re cash rich during these shows, and we know how that ends up for a lot of them, such as Danielle Oliveira, who was unable to pay her rent for months, but staying on topic, the fact that he had to ask her for rent, which she then handed him the 117 She didn’t even complain about it, but I’m just.. it just shows a huge crack in their partnership to begin with. So, couples keep their finances separate, fine, no issue there. However, if we are both on this lease, right? I live here, my spouse lives here, and I’m doing much better financially, and my spouse’s business is needing the money that he puts towards rent to go into his business. Then, why am I not then paying the rent, or why aren’t we splitting it to begin with? I understand keeping finances separate, but I do think it’s odd to say you keep finances separate, but yet your spouse is paying all the bills. Most of the people now who keep finances. Separate split things. Yes, so yeah, it seems like taking advantage that Kyle has a responsibility in there because he obviously agreed to it, and when he asked, she handed the money, but it just seems like before they got to this point of splitting and him needing to ask for the money because he’s lived here rent free for three years, so now pony up. Why wasn’t that a conversation that would have been the first conversation I would have had if I really didn’t want my spouse DJing, and I hear people shouting at their car stereo. Do people still say that right now? Going, oh, he would have DJed anyway, and maybe he would have, but my point is, you’re, and everyone’s, oh, she’s got a trust fund, she may, but the money that she was making, she was, it was raining on her with brand deals. She probably made that 117 First of all, that’s not everything she had. And again, nobody owes Carl an investment in Soft Bar, but I do recall Amanda making a comment. Oh, Cars upset, you’re best friends with Carl too. You couldn’t give him 5k it as a good faith donation when you just have 117 sitting there, and where’s the blowback on Amanda from Carl?

Amanda 11:05
Completely agree,

B 11:06
no one owes it to Carl, but if Carl’s gonna be angry, he should have been just as angry with rich ass Amanda and her brand deal account money.

Amanda 11:13
I just get the feeling that she thought of it in this childlike way, where Kyle’s money’s our money and my money’s my money,

B 11:21
and Carl and Kyle is responsible for that as well.

Amanda 11:25
Yeah, of course he is. But yes, of course he is. I will tell you, as somebody who had a previous marriage, and in my now in a new marriage, we both have our own children, and like it, we split things, yeah, because we, and we have joint accounts, and we have separate accounts, and, like, I pretty much always had that, just because, like, I’ve had expenses for work that have to go on, like, a separate credit card, and there’s just a lot of reasons for that, and it did seem wild to me that not only this was something that had to happen, this 107 but that Amanda was like, yeah, no big deal. So, then, if it was no big deal, why weren’t you helping before? It just.. it rubbed me the wrong way. It

B 12:08
rubbed me the wrong way. But then, the other side of me wondered why Kyle never asked before, and I assume he didn’t, since she gave it so easily.

B 12:16
Like, maybe

Amanda 12:16
there was an old-fashioned thinking in the beginning of their marriage: I’m the man, and I’m the successful one, and I’m going to support, and we do know that she wasn’t doing, but even off the strength of her salary from Summer House, she should have been contributing before any brand deal, because they had to be making even back in the day two 300 grand a year, which is significant money to then not be contributing to the household with, but I think back to your other thing about what if things had changed, and whatever I think Amanda told us herself she really hoped that when they got married that Kyle would settle down, and we then see him and his friend Kenny on in the city, who they are both very much work hard play hard people, and watching that show and hearing them talk and reflecting back, I can see things really clearly. I feel like Kyle works all day, goes to the gym, goes to bed during the week, and then parties on the weekends, and didn’t leave time for Amanda, she’s.. we don’t have a movie nights, and whatever, and I think Amanda withdrew further and further into herself, because we all have that experience where we settle down a little bit, and we’re not going out as much, but if you’re doing it by yourself, then it’s got to feel extremely lonely. Yes, and so I think the other thing, as we’re talking about all this, that I find really interesting is that really, for the first time, we’re hearing Amanda and Kyle air out dirty laundry about finances, lack of set. For years, it’s been Kyle parties too much and Amanda doesn’t party enough, and so that’s always been easy for us to take her side, but now I kind of wonder, has Kyle been protecting her over the years and willing to take the L with the fans about the parties too much, because he knows it’s part of his persona, and what keeps them, keeps them both, maybe on the show.

B 14:21
I have so many. They’re both very much at fault for the demise of, they just, they never planned on partnering. There’s just, there are so many different arrangements. Okay, financial arrangements, but it’s an arrangement that you speak with your partner about, and it just seems like they never had these important conversations. I just, that’s the only way to explain it. So, now we’re going to focus on them leaving the house. West was hugging Amanda, mind you. West was a couple hours before making out with Sierra, because they stayed up till 6am

Amanda 14:56
right?

B 14:56
So, Sierra comes up behind them and somebody says, Sierra, are you crying? And West jumps around now they’re all emotional. We discussed it about leaving the house, very guilty face. Amanda puts her hands on her face like that, like when you pull your face that stressed out. What was going on there? I know Lindsay on Watch What Happens Live, and Kyle, they’re still maintaining that they don’t think anything happened, they think West was trying to plant seeds. I think it’s more than that, and I think that Kyle, in the first opening scene, says that. But now that time has passed on his most recent Watch What Happens Live, he’s wanted to protect Amanda and put it on West.

Amanda 15:36
Right.

B 15:36
Okay, so I think that Amanda was with West. I think Amanda would have gotten in the car with Kyle, like she has the last 10 years, if she was not. I mean,

Amanda 15:44
yeah, I think, and we know the timing too, right? Because this was end of August, right, when the last weekend that they’re filming, and then we know US Open is always right around it’s two weeks, it’s two weeks, or whatever, right around Labor Day weekend,

B 16:01
and there’s so many different versions of this, and I’ve posted a bunch of them to my stories. There’s a version where it’s, oh, Wes was saying to her, ‘Good luck, because she had texted him, like, ‘I’m not going in the car with him. I think West knew she was going to a hotel. I don’t believe Amanda is a woman who could leave a relationship without something lined up. I’m just. I’m just gonna lay it there.

Amanda 16:21
I think that is a really interesting, an interesting thought, because I think you’re probably right. I never thought about that, and

B 16:29
I don’t think she thought that they would immediately become boyfriend-girlfriend, but I think that she had him in some capacity. She knew that even if she’s being realistic, he’d be focusing on her, because she’s new. It’s what are your thoughts on that?

Amanda 16:43
She was, as the poker players call it, spreading her bets, right? Because I think you’re right. I do think something was going on. I actually was having this in my notes to talk about, but I think two things can be true. I think she could have been in marriage counseling with Kyle, trying to see if they could figure something out, while also having this possibility with Wes, because the everyone’s talking about that moment where Sierra walks up and Lindsay’s, “Oh, are you crying? and Amanda looks shocked, and West looks guilty. The thing that I really noticed was earlier in the web, the upside when Amanda, so keep in mind this is the after the ski party, which, hello, the irony of that. Some of the house went out, some went to bed, some, including West and Sierra, stayed outside until five or six in the morning. Can you be, can you think of any other time when Kyle stayed out, Amanda stayed home, but then got up and looked all over for the for Kyle after he got home.

B 17:50
Never, never,

Amanda 17:52
never. She always stayed in bed,

B 17:55
maybe, maybe in the very beginning when she maybe in the beginning, not in years, not at least five summer.

Amanda 18:00
I feel like there was one time into the next morning she found him asleep on the couch, and like,

B 18:05
yeah,

Amanda 18:05
but that’s it, right? So, because she was mad, right, she would be mad, and she would cold shoulder, and that wouldn’t even acknowledge him. But Amanda, she didn’t get up to look for Kyle or get a glass of water at five in the morning, she got up, she was looking to see what West and Sierra were doing outside, because we’ve seen from earlier in the season she can see where people are in the house based on Find My Friends, so she was up looking to see what was going on with that. I will die on this hill

B 18:37
100% that is such a good point. I thought of it as I was watching it, but yeah, so the reunion trailer, when Sierra says that Wes will do anything to get back at her, that he’s only with Amanda to spite her, she’s talking about the fact that he hates her, because after they broke up season eight, his first season, all the fans turned on him, we saw him, we saw him acknowledge this in their makeup conversation by the boats, his second season, he was completely mute and scared. He resents her, and getting with Amanda was just a way to really give it to her good. And I think somehow him and Amanda convinced themselves that it wouldn’t be that big of a deal because of how Kyle treated her in the summer. I do think that him making out with Sierra, I don’t know if that was planned. I don’t know if he was doing that to spite Amanda or say to her, “You better get in that car without him and go to that hotel, or “I’m back to being with Sierra. It could be a couple of different manipulative, crazy things, but all roads lead back to him and Amanda having this thing going on, and

Amanda 19:42
yeah,

B 19:42
I don’t know, and somebody, okay, then somebody DM me, and they were like, B, Amanda checked out of the marriage in last spring, as noted by Carl, she came in this summer hot and heavy into Ben, that didn’t go her way, because he brought around Sabrina, and he didn’t, he wasn’t going there, and maybe that’s when she turned. To West, it could be, but she was checked out of the marriage, and as I said, and I will take the heat when I say this, there are women that won’t leave without having somebody lined up. Now, that doesn’t need to look like your husband’s close friend and your close friend’s ex, in this case, is that, but we know people, Amanda,

Amanda 20:19
yeah,

B 20:20
that broke up with one boyfriend and had somebody that they were interested in waiting, basically for them. When I mean, and I do agree with the thing in the trailer, when one of them goes, “Yeah, in high school, because I remember my girlfriends in high school would be fighting with their boyfriend, or sick of him, and he cheated, but they stayed together, and then she met another guy, and they would literally break up with the boyfriend, go home, and then go out with the new guy that same guy, we all know that, and this is to me, that’s Amanda.

Amanda 20:44
Now that it’s one of those things, now that you said it, I can’t unsee it, and I completely agree with you. I don’t know that I agree with you that West actively hated Sierra, and that he was doing all of this just to make her suffer. Well, I definitely see the point, and I can understand how people would feel that way. I don’t know if it’s that deep. I don’t know if he thinks about these things. I don’t know if he’s thinking about this as a chess game. I think that he probably only loves himself, and I don’t think he really truly loves or cares about any of them. I think I’m going to coin a term here, because I can’t think of anything better, and I am not a psychologist. I’m sure there’s an actual real term, but I think he is manipulatively apathetic. I like, thank you. I think that he knows how he understands, he has the wherewithal to understand how people will feel in situations, and which is why he seems like such a good guy to everybody, because he’s good about making everybody feel seen and liked, but I don’t think he really cares about them unless it affects him, and it’s and if it’s something that feels good in the moment, he does it, and that’s if you think about the other women he’s done this to. He also had two secret girlfriends through the whole time, because he had to go, and when the scandal was breaking, he, it wasn’t just Mayha, it was also Chailene that he had to go and talk to. And

B 22:17
yes,

Amanda 22:18
I don’t think he really cared if he really cared about his friendships, and we’ve said this a million times, but then he wouldn’t have done it. He didn’t care about Sierra really. That’s why I think it’s manipulative apathy.

B 22:30
Honestly, that makes a lot of sense. And I will tell you, in my DMs, a lot of people say that. A lot of people say exactly that. He doesn’t care about any of them. He doesn’t care about a mandate, doesn’t care about Sierra, he doesn’t care about Mejia, he doesn’t care about Shailene, he just does what he does in the moment, and the fallouts, the fallout, and he just stays mute.

Amanda 22:47
Yeah, West does West,

B 22:49
yeah,

Amanda 22:49
and that’s how he is, I think. Now it’s really, I don’t think he’s sorry, I think he just realizes things didn’t go the way, and that he, they, he thought they would, I think he had the, I don’t even know what the word is, but he had the balls, essentially to think nobody’s really going to care, because Kyle was so terrible to Amanda, everyone’s going to be okay with not even really thinking about Sierra in all of this,

B 23:16
and meantime, I’ll watch what happens live, Lindsay made a comment, Kyle was like, listen, I will never, because Andy said what was in your voice note, and Andy’s what was in your voice note, and Kyle, I’m a rambler, but I will tell you that I said, listen, I don’t ruin people’s careers, I will never say I won’t film with somebody, whatever it is, it’ll be, and then Lindsay said something like, yeah, some people do that to themselves, so she was insinuating that he wasn’t going to be back because of the network didn’t want him, and then Andy goes, so are you gonna talk to West, and Kyle says, yeah, I think I have to tomorrow, so I don’t know if the network was filming that somebody was making them meet up,

Amanda 23:49
yeah,

B 23:49
I think I don’t know if Kyle, I do believe Kyle, first of all, when he says that he won’t have anyone fired, but although the whole Hannah burner of it all, but maybe he learned from that, I do believe that if he has to film with Wes, he will, but based on what Lindsay said, and based on Kyle almost getting out in front of it, I don’t see how Wes does come back. But okay, I know I’m getting off track, but

Amanda 24:08
well, and maybe

Amanda 24:09
what she also meant is everybody else doesn’t want to film with him right now, because he did this to himself, and it might not be

B 24:16
on you,

Amanda 24:17
but you and I both know decisions are going to be made quite soon, because they always record, start filming on Fourth of July weekend, right? Jumping around a little bit, because that’s what we’ve been doing, and so did the show. I kind of want to go back to the in the city premiere, because we have to give ourselves our flowers, but we were in the opening scene of In the City, the headline from our website about Kyle and Amanda confirming their split, but Cocktail is already new, and you guys did. And then, even better later, full screen, we are post about Danielle. This is from August of last year. Danielle being with a married man that was also featured full screen, so that was exciting for

B 25:06
us, very exciting.

Amanda 25:07
Yeah, her book, I’m you guys, I’m gonna do my best. I think I’m just gonna have to phonetically write Owen every time I see his name, because I have a

B 25:16
room, you know? I wrote Owen in the notes,

Amanda 25:18
but

B 25:19
somebody on his show said it too, they were like, “What’s his name? Oh, Ian,

Amanda 25:22
Ian, I was thinking it was Ian for a long time, and like, this is not me being purposely shady, so we’re just gonna try to keep it phonetic, but within the city, starting it was, it was interesting, because we have our thoughts, somebody actually asked me, I forgot to text this to you. Somebody asked on Discord yesterday. They’re like, why is Danielle even on in the city? I just wrote back, and they mad at us because we posted that she was dating a married man in August, and then sure enough they started filming in September. Okay, so now I’m getting myself confused about where we even are because of the how all this works. So Amanda and Kyle kind of transition to in the city, and then we hear they show the and refer to the joint statement, and then we see a scene with Kyle and Amanda meeting at Kyle’s apartment to hash out what was happening in present day, but then again, like I said, we go back to September on the rest of the show, and we’re seeing kind of the fall of their relationship and them fighting about marriage counseling and all of that, back in September.

B 26:43
Okay, so they had no choice either way, because with or without the west of it all, we all knew that in the city is opening with them in marriage counseling, but they announced their separation in January. I don’t know how they thought they would make it without doing that, but whatever. So that opening scene with Kyle and Amanda is important, and I’m going to explain why I said it a little bit at the top of the pod, but this is an important piece. We’re watching Kyle now in May, and in April, let’s say in May, and a couple weeks, this was filmed very raw. Okay, this was a couple of days after the announcement from Wes and Amanda that they were exploring their relationship was made, so we are seeing Kyle’s real true reaction, not the reaction that we are seeing weeks later when he is in protect Amanda mode, because she is eaten by the wolves. Okay, so in the conversation that we see, Kyle questions her specifically, throws out Thanksgiving, says that he hears things and wants to know if she cheated on him, because at that point they were still supposedly working on their relationship. She gets super defensive, she screams, she yells, and says, “Las a video of you making out with somebody. Okay, I love how Kyle just goes, “Okay, which is sad, because he doesn’t even know if there is. I can tell you, there are no videos of him. There’s videos of him flirting and being inappropriate, like that one in Vegas, when he was like very close.

Amanda 28:07
What about the one where sorority housed, and I don’t know where it was, but they were in Charleston, I believe, and he’s.. it looks like it’s in the corner of a bar, and he’s, you, his back is turned to the camera, and you can’t tell what’s going on, but it doesn’t, it didn’t look just friendly,

B 28:24
so maybe she’s referencing that one, I can’t think of, but regardless, we all know that Kyle has cheated, and he hasn’t denied if he’s cheating, what he is asking her in this conversation is whether she was physical with West or they decided to separate, and while they were in marriage counseling, or over the summer, when they were still fully together. According to them, we know that they may have been separate. In any event,

Amanda 28:46
yeah,

B 28:47
she totally throws a complete hissy fit, and it’s very true to their relationship. She throws him off track, and so he’s left defending himself.

Amanda 28:55
It’s deflection,

B 28:56
it’s deflection, and this is the thing about it. Kyle is 100% wrong. We know he cheated on her, but he’s asking her, did you also cheat on me? She denies it. I don’t believe her, and I don’t believe that Kyle believes her. I believe he’s being ambiguous now, because now number one, he is a show that needs to be successful, and number two, and we heard Lindsay say it on Watch What Happens Live, Lindsay said, Listen, whatever you want to say about Kyle is a husband. I think we’ve all seen throughout this breakup that he loves Amanda, and regardless of what has transpired, he wants to do right. He wants her to be okay. He’s worried about her, he’s protecting her. So fine, but it doesn’t mean that she didn’t hook up with him.

Amanda 29:36
I agree with everything you’re saying. I think he is protecting her in that moment, because he does, he just lets it go, he just says, yeah, okay.

B 29:45
And I have to ask you this, okay, because this is an important question, and I want all you people listening to think about this too. Okay, let’s say that this guy was actually that West friend guy, okay? So Aiden, whatever that guy’s name was, so it wasn’t one of Kyle’s friends, it wasn’t any. Of her close friends, ex-boyfriends, it was just some guy, and over the summer, or in the fall, when they were supposedly working on their relationship, Amanda was actually out fooling around with that guy. I personally can tell you, I think that I would be sitting here going, ‘Good for her. Kyle cheated on her a lot, she was done putting up with it, she met somebody that she liked and gave her attention, and kudos to her, because he did it first. Two wrongs don’t make a right, but if your husband’s out there cheating, and you meet a guy, and you want to cheat, then that’s your business. I don’t think it would be.. I don’t think I would feel bad for Kyle. I would think, you know what, this, they should split. This hasn’t been good for a long time, but Amanda’s doing what Kyle’s done to her for years. Do you agree?

Amanda 30:40
I don’t know that I agree, and I think it’s gonna come down to some of the little subtleties for me. If she’s saying to him, ‘No, I’m not. I just need space from you. Yes, I’m living in a different place, but we are going to marriage counseling with the idea that we’re trying to put things back together,

B 30:59
which is what she says on the card review that I saw today, that’s exactly what she says to him. Yeah,

Amanda 31:04
then I still would think that it was wrong.

B 31:07
I think, as

Amanda 31:08
wouldn’t be

Amanda 31:09
as wrong. Yeah, I wouldn’t. No, definitely not. I would think Kyle would be justified in being upset about that, but no, we definitely wouldn’t feel anger about that in general, because I think we would have felt like they were gone there, they were on their way out anyway. We know that they didn’t even leave the Hamptons together, and that this was Amanda, probably shouldn’t have struggled along, but no, this is so.. that’s where I’m saying I agree with you to a certain point. I don’t.. I agree, though, though we wouldn’t have been as angry,

B 31:40
and also not to blame Kyle, but in the way that we’re seeing him support her, and not that I’m saying he should be vicious towards her and throw mud, that’s not what I’m saying, but he’s doing clearly more than being amicable, he’s going out of his way to paint Mest West as the manipulator who planted seeds and tricked Amanda, almost as if Amanda had no say, I do think that their dynamic played into Amanda being the perennial victim, and listen, she should have had these skills even at 23 when they got together to advocate for herself and to whatever, but she didn’t, and she never learned them, and she had a very strong personality of a husband to do all her bidding and all of these things, and they’re still in that dynamic, and that you see him struggle with it at the reunion. Do I have to go after her?

Amanda 32:27
No, I fully agree. Not only that, it was something that it was almost.. it became something she almost enjoyed.

B 32:33
Yes, is

Amanda 32:33
having that. And then, of course, a couple weeks ago, when they’re fighting, then she doesn’t say, because Lindsay’s grilling, Kyle, and Amanda doesn’t say a word, and Kyle yells “fuck you, and Amanda’s.. wait, I didn’t even say she loves it, she loves it, and there’s something really messed up and very toxic about that too, but the other thing I was like, my blood was boiling, because this is the most diabolical diabolicalness she in that same conversation, when they’re sitting on their couch, she throws Sierra under the bus. Sorry, not the same conversation in April, the one in September. She throws Sierra under the bus by saying it was Sierra’s idea that they separate for a month. What a coward. You’re having serious conversations about your marriage, about divorcing. Now is not a time where you try to lessen the hurt by saying what you’re really feeling, just to try to make somebody else, the other person, feel better. You don’t mince words, you say how you really feel, or else Kyle’s gonna wonder, yeah, is that really how Amanda felt, or is that how Sierra felt? Is Sierra the problem? It’s just cowardly,

B 33:46
and actually, the definition of coward, and the way it’s generally characterized, is a person allowing fear to stop them from doing what is right, expected, or necessary. So, coward is the exact word,

Amanda 33:58
yeah,

B 33:59
and this is not defense. I’m not defending Amanda. I honestly think Amanda doesn’t know what she wants, so yeah. And I think that’s why her relationship with Kyle worked, because I do think that Kyle is guilty of telling Amanda what she wants, and I think that so when Amanda does think something in a conversation with a friend, I don’t think Amanda can ever assume responsibility. So Amanda might really believe that in that conversation with Sierra, it was Sierra’s idea, because she’s so used to assuming other people’s, and we even see it with her dressing like West, and people pointed out, which is over my head, I’m not such a detail-oriented person, but when I saw other accounts like Face Reality and pointed out, like, how she almost mimicked Wes’ pattern of speech, it makes me sad for her, because there’s nothing there. She just assumes other people’s. When she was with Kyle, it was Kyle’s opinion. She’s in a conversation with Ciara, because she’s mad at. Kyle, she almost sees it as Sierra’s opinion when she’s sharing what her marriage is like, and Sierra is based off what she’s telling her, being like, “So, you’re gonna stay there, or you think you should separate? And then she goes, “I would, but he would never go for it. You’re an adult, he doesn’t have to go for it, he’s not your parent there, there’s no consent form that he needs to sign, hon.

Amanda 35:18
Yeah,

B 35:19
and it’s right back to what our friend Bish therapist talked about with triangulation,

Amanda 35:23
totally,

B 35:24
she involves other people into her marriage. This is a trend, she consistently does it, and she does it so that she can back off if she wants to. She could have

Amanda 35:31
given herself an out,

B 35:32
that’s right, and it’s just unfair. And I think we would have all continued to feel sorry for her, but then when you take that personality, right, and you couple with what she knowingly did to Sierra, it’s fuck you, you can’t just do whatever you want and be like, I’m sorry, I’m a victim, even at the reunion when Sierra says one thing to her, she’s, I need a break, but this is why people don’t do this, because they want to keep friends, they want to maintain relationships. You know what I’m saying.

Amanda 36:06
Yeah, and I will tell you guys some of the hardest conversations that I have had with my friends, my good friends, has been when one of us hurts each other’s feelings. It’s freaking hard to realize how you made somebody feel and apologize, or to have been hurt and explain what hurt you, and then that is really hard to do, and like I have my friends are better friends for it, and I think they would say the same thing. I just start to wonder, is Amanda even really capable of that? Because it feels like she’s not. So, yeah.

B 36:47
So, jumping back into in the city, we see them go out for their anniversary, which was like a dreadful, like their four years. Clearly, things are very bad for her moving out, but she springs on him that they’re moving out again. I,

Amanda 37:01
yeah,

B 37:01
we know that she was already living on her own. Guys, this was a storyline, that’s why, like, when I see the rhetoric, like, “Oh, Amanda’s such a bitch for saying it at their anniversary dinner, that was all planned.

Amanda 37:10
Yeah,

B 37:11
we, our timeline was always correct. Okay, we posted that we had been hearing in September that she was moved out. They admit to November, but we’re watching on the show, it’s September, and she’s saying I’m getting my own apartment, and next week she’s packing up. She was already fcking gone,

Amanda 37:30
she was gone. Yeah, it always comes back to the dogs for me, always, because that was all the proof I needed when we had cocktails sending pictures of each of them separately walking one dog in different neighborhoods, we always say this, guys, but sometimes the littlest bit of tea that gets sent in is that last piece of the puzzle that we needed to really complete the picture, so we knew, and I remember even getting annoyed at during Bravo Con, because I’m like, they’re not admitting it, that there’s, but we can see it so clearly. Yeah, we can see it. It’s done.

B 38:05
So, just a little exclusive tea for you guys, because this was pretty hot. Got some intel about Amanda’s swim line. The person said, “Hi, B. I have an insight. I have insider info from someone who works at South Moon under about Amanda’s swimsuit line. The following, okay, there wasn’t an.. so this is what the person said. There wasn’t an actual final straw. The brand just isn’t sure what’s gonna happen at the reunion, and it’s not looking good for Amanda. She seems to be really defensive from the leaks. So basically, the owners of the company were like, “Let’s pull it, it’s too risky. They told me that they will be rebranding the Amanda Swim Lime to Ila Swim. By the way, day after I posted this, they dropped ELA swim. They actually have a pair of mesh pants on there called the Mandy pants, and they are a similar – they’re different pattern, but same pants from her line. They said she’s hard to work with, basically what you would expect. Doesn’t answer texts or emails, goes you. Kyle definitely ran her business, which is another thing that we’ve heard that he basically also managed her brand deals and everything like that. She never even asked South Moon Under what the sales were. Could you imagine?

Amanda 39:11
No, she, I mean,

B 39:12
she designed the swimwear, but South Moon Under paid for everything up front, so that’s why they were able to just do a new photo shoot with new bikini models, wipe her name because she got paid, she designed, and then so somebody else reached out. They were like, I work, I work in merchandising, branding, whatever. They’re like, when they say she designed it, she literally was like, put a bow in the middle, you know what I mean? It was whatever, but they paid for everything, and she was working for them, so it wasn’t like it was ever hers. And the person said, I’ve heard all she does is ski and drink martinis with Wes. They also said at the last photo shoot, and I remember this because when she posted the bathing suits, this was before the scandal. She was so thin, but again I was thinking it was the stress of the separation, not skiing. They said she was down two sizes, and they were all like, “What’s going on now? This is not a girl, and in that scene with Kyle, she looked so. So unhealthy, thin,

Amanda 40:01
she looked gaunt in the face, yeah,

B 40:04
but

B 40:04
even her upper body, she was wearing that T-shirt, and she just looked like she looked like a kid in

Amanda 40:09
it, yeah, guys, I, in my marketing career, I’ve worked with celebrity contracts, and every contract, every celebrity contract has a clot, like a morality closet, it right where the brand can yank a deal if the per the celebrity is seen to do something illegal or do something even unsavory, so it doesn’t surprise me that they were able to do that so quickly, and that they didn’t make a big splash about it, because they probably exercise the morality clause, and there’s nothing she could do about it.

B 40:48
Exactly, should we do have Rhode Island, or should we do the Valley, or should we do the Indus?

Amanda 40:56
I feel like we have talked about Danielle. Yeah,

B 41:00
and there’ll be more insight about that as time goes, as we see more,

Amanda 41:03
yeah, and as everybody understands all the characters more, so let’s talk about the valley, yeah, because it’s been slow, but I feel like it really picked up, so you guys will remember the last episode before, I guess two episodes ago ended as they were getting ready for this drag show pageant, Danny has been awful the entire trip. He’s been sober, yelling at Nia to hand him a blanket when she, a breastfeeding mother, is trying to eat. And you and I have both been there someday. The amount of things that you can do when you have a baby with one hand surprises you right, like he was fully capable of grabbing a freaking blanket. I just still get so mad about that, because there was nothing that Nia had to do. He was just being a jerk while sober, yelling at her about letting, wanting the nanny to do everything, yelling at her that she’s being performative at the amusement park, so Lala walks in as Nia is helping Danny get ready, and here’s what he’s saying, yelling at Nia. Lala jumps in and says, “You shouldn’t talk to Nia like that, your behavior, and you’re also that your behavior is feeling triggering to her, to Lala. So Lala also says, really, what we’ve all been thinking, like, if Danny treats Nia like this in front of everyone, including the cameras, obviously, how is he treating her at home when nobody else is around? So that happens at the end of the previous episode. This episode picks up right in that argument where Danny starts to yell back, and Mala Lala starts to mock her saying that his beauty pageant name is going to be Miss triggered, just ambient yelling, and Nia even says at one point she agrees with Lala that he’s being awful.

B 42:51
Also, he was supposed to be on Watch What Happens Live, but dropped out due to an exciting work project, which Andy was like, “Oh yeah, no, I heard he is working. Danny, we all know why you didn’t go. You, I

Amanda 43:01
guess,

Amanda 43:01
because he got a screener, yeah, he got a screener, and he saw how bad it was, and was like,

B 43:05
here’s the thing, I posted, and then last night he posted some statement apologizing to Nia with a lot of buts, no, not a Carl apology, and one of these, but oh, I know it seems that way, and I love my wife, and I should never do that, but here’s the thing, a lot of people in the comments are likely have four kids, they’re very religious, all of these things. Danny is verbally abusive. I think Lala put it really good when she was like, “listen” in her confessional, and he didn’t like what she said to him, “You have one too many, whatever, no judgment. He doesn’t know me to say that, which nobody needs to know you, okay? Lala said, “I think he’s a good guy, she may be giving him too much credit, because I don’t think it’s just the alcohol. I’m going to be honest, but yeah, Lala said remove the alcohol, and then you’re fine. She said it in her confessional. Danny is verbally abusive to Nia. Full stop. I don’t want to know what he says behind closed doors, because what he does, I’m sure it’s worse. What he does in front of everybody is not okay, and anyone who perceives that. Yes, I understand. They have four young children, got it? They are on vacation with their friends, they are being paid to film, they have one baby with them. Okay? If he is acting like that when one child is there, if he is acting like that in front of a camera, is he.. if he is acting like that on a fun trip, I can only imagine how he is privately in their home when he’s stressed, when there’s a financial concern, when all four kids are needing something. I can only imagine he first of all, I don’t think they have any business being on the show. I don’t see how they will continue, because he is going to need to get serious help. I understand there are four children in the mix. I understand they’re very faith-based. However, I’m watching a woman in an emotionally abusive relationship, so I really hope he hears it’s interesting. We hear a lot about the fan backlash, and now people are writing comments about Amanda or about Danny and. About how we’re so judgmental, and we think who we are. I don’t mean we, as in bloggers,

Amanda 45:04
fans and

B 45:05
fans,

Amanda 45:05
yeah,

B 45:06
the collective we. Here’s the thing that I always say, I wouldn’t know who in the fuck Danny and Nia were. They chose to come on the show, they chose to show us their lives. I am watching an emotionally abusive relationship. I don’t have a psychiatric degree. I don’t need one to know what I saw. I am married for 20 years, and if my husband ever spoke to me like that, I certainly wouldn’t have been around to have it’s ridiculous.

Amanda 45:30
The next conversation, the

B 45:31
next conversation, so

Amanda 45:32
yeah,

B 45:32
I really hope that he hears the feedback, and he really, because he’s got a lot to lose, he’s got a wonderful, beautiful wife, and I don’t appreciate how his wife coddles him. I don’t get the whole fucking thing. I’m sorry. I know I’m outspoken, and a man like Danny would never be interested in me anyway. So, I’m Mark safe, but I just.. and you know what? The next time my daughter annoys me with her smart ass mouth, which is just like mine, I’m gonna not even be bothered, because men like Danny won’t ever come near my fucking daughter, that’s for sure, because they will run for the hills.

Amanda 46:04
I have to say something that made me uncomfortable in what Lala was saying, and that kind of just came back up again. Nowhere in the Bible, nowhere in modern Christianity, is it being preached that a husband can be a complete asshole to his wife, this is not a religion thing, and it just makes me a little bit mad, because I’ve talked about my faith on the podcast. I am Catholic, and it.. there’s nothing that this is not an encouraged behavior by any anything within Christianity.

B 46:40
I’m Catholic. My father’s Catholic, my husband is Catholic. My father and my husband have never spoke to me, my mother ever. Like that is not a thing. I don’t like, is that a thing placed on religion? I don’t even know what that’s about. See, so we’re super religious. Our Orthodox Jewish people allowed to verbally abuse is just because, no, they’re devout in their faith. Being devout in your faith means that you’re kind to people. Last time I checked,

Amanda 47:05
and that’s where I’m like, I understand. Maybe I think where Lala was trying to go, but I don’t think there’s.. I don’t think she was justifying or saying that it’s because of the religion that Danny does this. I think probably more what she meant is that it’s probably more why Nia

B 47:26
Valerie

Amanda 47:27
acts the way that she does in front of the cameras, right? Because she does it. I’m watching with my husband last night, and we’re both like, I cannot even believe that this is going on, and my husband just.. I don’t know, he’s.. how does somebody treat somebody like this? He’s. I just don’t, we neither of us, no, nobody thinks it’s okay, and also

B 47:47
it’s so mean. How do you treat the woman I love like that?

Amanda 47:51
It’s awful. So, anyway, that’s just been something that’s really been bothering me. It’s there’s nothing in modern Christianity that says men can be total jerks. Thank you for addressing that,

B 48:02
because that’s a very good point.

Amanda 48:03
Yeah, so I don’t even know, obviously Danny put that apology on his on the same background that he used to announce that he wasn’t coming to watch what happens live, and like it was like, yeah, we had a really hard time in our marriage, and I, yes, I’m not discounting it. Did not feel like a real apology to your point.

B 48:27
I’m not discounting that it’s hard to have four young children. You and I have both had two young children. I said on the pod, and it’s very unpopular, and I shouldn’t say it out loud, but I’m confused as to why they kept having children, because they were very stressed out to begin with, so I just, whatever, none of my business, but again, my business, because you’re on TV, and so help your wife. Yes, it’s hard for you, it’s harder for her, because she’s doing everything while you’re sitting there complaining that she has a baby with her. It’s your baby, she didn’t just volunteer to take somebody’s child with her, you made this baby. This is your baby, and also he has now isolated her, living in Santa Clarita, wherever the hell that is. And it’s.. I just.. I worry about Danny, because I don’t think he gets it. And

Amanda 49:17
I.. I also agree with you, though. By the way, I don’t mean to interrupt, but I don’t think it’s just when he’s had a couple of drinks,

B 49:23
no, and I don’t think he gets it, and I said I worry about Danny, I worry about Nia, but I worry like I don’t know how this marriage survives if he’s not willing to really get help,

Amanda 49:35
yeah, and again, like to me Lala is the best person to talk to him about this.

B 49:42
She’s a

Amanda 49:42
recovery alcohol. Yeah, she, yes, and she realized that she didn’t like who she became when she drank, and she did something about it. I feel again, saying you’re not that kind of friend to me is another form of deflection. But before we wrap up, I do want. I just talk really quickly about Janet, and Janet, the next morning, is in a room with Michelle and Lala, and they’re talking about the situation, and Janet’s Danny and Nia would rather cut people out of their life when who say things about them, but I could not see these two different as these two things as more different, because Lala, yes, she did escalate by yelling back at Danny, but overall I don’t think she was in the wrong. She witnessed Danny real time mistreating Nia, called him out in the moment. Janet got involved in something that she didn’t witness herself, wouldn’t stop talking about it, even though it didn’t involve her, and then up the ante by putting a label of sexual assault on Danny, which, while the term may have technically been correct, that term implies R A P E, and I do not think those two situations are the same.

B 50:58
I 100% agree with you. I also don’t think Lala was wrong, and I’ll tell you who I do think is wrong. Every other person who witnessed it, namely Jesse, who allowed not only Nia to get spoken to like that, but then watched Lala get spoken to, that sitting right there, it really bothered me. And it bothered me because Jesse is very far from a shrinking violet, and I really expected more of him.

Amanda 51:21
I did too.

B 51:22
I really expected. I hope that it’s addressed at the reunion in regards to Jesse, and I hope that Jesse apologizes to at least Lala, because Mia is in the marriage, and he could rightly say Mia does not want people involved in her marriage. It’s not like there was a physical threat or whatever, and I could say, like Nia did say in the confessional, first, Lala, it’s none of your business, which it’s like, here’s another thing, I’m just gonna put this out here. If you’re in a marriage like that and it’s none of our business, don’t come around me, because I can tell, no, I’m serious.

Amanda 51:52
Don’t come on our television,

B 51:54
I put, and I’m very fortunate, I thank God, don’t have friends like this, but I have been around couples in a variety of social settings, where it’s like that, and those are not couples that my husband and I would call to go out to dinner. Now, that is not to say my husband and I have a perfect marriage, right, and that we never have a disagreement or anything like that, but you guys know the couple that I’m talking about, the lame as a Robs, or the one who’s like Danny, who makes.. I don’t want to be.. I don’t want to be around that.

Amanda 52:21
Yeah,

B 52:22
yeah, like none of us do. It’s uncomfortable. I am not going to sit and watch my friend be spoken to by her husband like that and not be allowed to say anything. That’s fine. Then I shall see you when he ain’t around. Yeah, and I’m not personally in that situation, but if I were,

Amanda 52:37
no, I would. But we’ve all been in situations like I’m not

B 52:40
currently in that situation. I will say that, but I can tell you that under no circumstance would I continue to do any activities with her husband, and if that meant that I didn’t see her because she was mad about it, okay? But also, I don’t want to be like.. I just wouldn’t..

Amanda 52:55
I know, same, same.

B 52:56
But we love you guys. Sorry to end on a very annoying note,

B 52:59
but

B 53:00
the theme of the pod is coward.

Amanda 53:03
True, it’s true, Danny. I just.. I really hope, because I will just say, seeing this episode really helps you better understand why Nia, or why Lala said on live television, I hope she leaves him, because..

B 53:20
and to be fair, what I saw, I hope that he gets help, and that he learns to communicate better, but he has

Amanda 53:26
anger

B 53:26
help too. It’s not just alcohol help, it’s anger help too, it’s psychiatric help, and maybe he does have a chemical imbalance that causes him to act this way. If he had diabetes, he’d need medicine, maybe he needs medicine, not my business, I’m not a doctor, but he needs to address whatever’s going on,

Amanda 53:40
yeah. Agreed.

B 53:41
Love you guys.

Amanda 53:43
Bye, everybody.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai